THE CATHOLIC KNIGHT: Speaking as one lowly voice within the Catholic Church, I implore you, for the sake of the Church herself, please reconcile.
We traditionalists within the Church NEED your help. Please come to our assistance.
I ask all my readers to please pray for God's will to be done with the SSPX this Divine Mercy Sunday.
22 comments:
If they are not required to assent to Vatican II as a super-dogmatic council, then I believe we will see some sort of "reconciliation."
Bishop Fellay is trying to be careful because with this reconciliation means having to deal with extremely hostile bishops and also the problems of the Novus Ordo.
They will reconcile if Rome allows them to keep their current positions on the Novus Ordo and Vatican II, which may be possible, but it could also change the face of the church over night and have huge implications into the crisis in the church and what approved questioning of Vatican II and the Novus Ordo Missae means for the church in the future. This is why Pope Benedict as for clarifications of their position most likely because of these theological positions the SSPX holds, which I also hold. :)
They've been assisting you for 40 years in the Church and haven't stopped.
If they do assent, which will be great in and of itself, we still have to worry about that Holocaust denying Bishop bringing scandal on the Church. Of course in the long run that will probably be worth it and its actually a small error that can be easily amended compared to some other Bishops outside the order we can ALL name.
Sir Knight,
If it were not for the Eastern Rites, I would have signed onto the SSPX without a second thought. I have been petitioning our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ in the form of the novina leading up to divine Mercy Sunday for a comprehensive reconcilliation between the two groups; we need the SSPX, the SSPX (especially in the longer term - think third and fourth generation succession etc.,) needs the greater Catholic Church.Oh God, why has the wrecking ball of the Church higher eschellons ruined it for everyone over the past fifty years (especially from the 60's - early 90's) so we have one wretched mire of a mess to clean up? If B16 can make room for the 'neocats' (don't even get me started there) surely he can make room for the SSPX!! And perhaps they will be a voice of conscience to prompt Papa Bennie to think twice before giving the green light to such dreadful concepts as the 'Neocat' way...what in Heaven and earth was the Holy Father thinking??!!!
Feeling dispondant and as if the darkness and eclipse will never end, as its business as usual culturally, civically, and ecclesially.
Blessings,
Sarah,
Australia.
amen, Sir Knight!
According to The Catholic Culture website, the SSPX response was already sent to Rome as of Friday April 13. As of yet, Rome has no public comment. So now we wait and see.
According to a leading British (and very traditionalist) commentator, William Oddie, the SSPX have asked the Vatican to declare the Novus Ordo Mass invalid and to repudiate Vatican II as basic conditions for their return. Assuming this to be true, the SSPX seem absolutely determined to remain outside the Church indefinitely and are certainly no friends of those faithful to the Magisterium. If this does turn out to be true, I hope that the many traditionalist bloggers who have expressed suppor for these schismatics will repudiate them permanently and completely.
IF the SSPX rejects the offer from Rome, it will surely evolve into a schismatic group, especially as the need for successor bishops comes along. While the SSPX may have "stood its ground" regarding the new mass, it has so spawned a number of open and not so openly splinter, sedevacantist groups. It is time for the SSPX to get real and get fully catholic. Pete Frey
The "Church" has strayed from the Catholic Faith. Not the SSPX. It's either the pure Catholic Faith or It's not. If the SSPX compromises on the Faith then there is no Faith anymore. The SSPX is absolutely within the will of God to stand firm in the Faith of Jesus Christ even if those in control of the Church (humanly speaking) do not.
-R.Starr
I can understand allowing the mass in people's own language. I don't understand why they banned the Latin Mass back in 1970 rather than just allow both Latin and translated versions?
And why did they make further changes that went beyond just translation such as music and liturgy changes?
As a young Catholic I would like understand these contradictions.
Lefebvrians. Reaching an agreement -- Fellay replies.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqUXHD9n6B8
to "R STARR" it is heresy to claim that the "church" is not the church, that only the sspx is truly catholic. I would remind all sedevacantist wanna be's that we never had a "Pope Marcel" who, by his own authority, "Accused" the council and claimed "Rome is in schism" While his stand in favor of the traditional mass was laudable, and i fully supported it, it seems his followers have evolved his name into a cult. This is the essence, not of catholicism, but of another form of protestantism, with the usual pride, arrogance and self-righteousness which have accomplanied all of them since Martin Luther---- pujtting themselves above the church, and ultimately outside of it. My bottom line is, if the SSPX rejects Rome's offer and still refuses to recognize the validity of Vatican II (even while disagreeing with some of its muddled statements) and the validity of the Novus Ordo (even with its inherent weaknesses), they should be intellectually honest and go their own way. No Sir Knight, traditionalism DOES NOT need them. They need the church. Pete Frey.
Pete, when I said we need the SSPX I meant we need them to help expedite the process of reforming the Church. Yes, the Church can heal herself without them, but it would likely take longer. Having them within the fold helps both the SSPX and the Church. Outside of the fold, the SSPX is left in ruin while the Church is left with a much slower healing process.
Well, I hope they come to an equitable agreement. It will certainly benefit both. Now that the Anglicans have come into the fold it's time to open talks with the polish national catholic church. When the Turks were putting the squeeze on the Ecumenical patriarch the church should have extended a hand of unity promising to extend the full political and social power of the church and faithful to to put the squeeze back on the turks and their aspirations of European Union Membership.
R. Starr's got it right. Unless the Vatican deals with the doctrinal issues (which Bishop Fellay's Candlemas sermon indicated had not been the case in the discussions),there is no reconciliation possible. SSPX will continue to stand at the door knocking, as Bishop Fellay put it. They will not 'develop into schmatics' because they do not deny any article of Catholic Faith except the novelties introduced at Vatican II (William Oddie, called a traditionalist by one commenter, is of the type that denies this language even when someone holds it up to his face; fortunately now many theologians are conceding the point that yes, the Council has doctrinal problems). Those novelties have been clearly named and the sources of tradition they deny have been clearly named. There will be development into schism from the liberal ranks, not from SSPX--they are doing so now, liturgically, doctrinally, calling themselves Catholics but practicing protestantism in chapter and verse. SSPX is not doing so, nor will, having laid out its position so clearly and in such detail. When the heretics in Rome have realized Teilhard de Chardin's dream, traditionalists will have no place to turn but SSPX. Pray they hold on to the truth! Or they will end up like FSSP, hiding in their churches during ecumenical week, morally destroyed.
The Traditional Catholics within the fold need the help of SSPX for reform within and they need Pope B16 and the entire body of Christ in order to grow. We very much need each other as Sir Knight has said. If they are regularized there will be countless of Traditional Catholics who will be thrilled to join them in worship. Traditional Catholicism will grow and then we'll finally see the reform within Holy Mother Church take place. This all will not take place without suffering.
Our family is praying that soon we'll be able to commune with our dearest friends who are in the SSPX. As a faithful Traditional Catholic homeschooling mother within the church, it is quite difficult to find kindred spirited Catholics. It doesn't help living in a liberal state. However, finally when in desperation and utter loneliness, after many prayers our Lord sent us a beautiful family from SSPX. I'm thankful for their friendship and beautiful exemplary life of purity.
I know that many members of the society are fearful of regularization for several reasons. My hope and prayers for all of you in SSPX are that if and when you are regularized into the fold, that you'll be welcoming to those who come to your door and that you will trust in the plan of God for His bride. After all, He has permitted all of this to happen, in the end for His Glory!
My brothers and sisters in Christ, let us all pray for the restoration of our church, Open our hearts and our mind to all that is happening now within our church, count all catholics nowadays who knows the catholic faith, just go inside the church on the new mass and observe the people around, you can see many ways that the faith is declining and some novelties on the mass existing. Its for your own self to know the truth that SSPX is true or not. Before condemning them, try to know them first, why did they exist? This group would not exist if there is no reason behind that they are formed. As a vicar of Christ the Pope i think is much better the one to directly in contact with them to know their position because He is the leader who may know what is right for the church and not giving representative in behalf of him who we do not know is giving an exact position of SSPX to him.
I pray for regularisation. I pray that the few issues left to be ironed out can be agreed upon finally; We have an SSPX congregation twenty minutes away from us here and it would be lovely to be able to have them as a vibrant part of the Sydney Catholic community, as currently their chappels outnumber our one excellent yet solitary FSSP congregation. I sent a lengthy response to the commenter vexed about VII and the innovations that followed which led to demolition of sacred altar art, irregularities in the liturgy and so forth; it appears that blogger has eaten the comment, so in a nutshell, I'll try again. the VII document that deals with the liturgy is Sacro Sanctum Consillium. found in English at www.vatican.va Tragically, the 'SPIRIT OF VI crowd have done much that is not permitted within SSC and never intended by the authors in my humble belief. Prior to VII experimentation with liturgy was going on but it was sparce and quiet; VII gave the assumed green light to those already rebellious in spirit re sacred liturgy, the physical manifestations of our faith from architecture to music to the humble mantilla and so much more. Fr. Z. over at www.wdtprs.com has some excellent articles with equally excellent comments dealing with this. In the end, the immaculate heart of Mary and most sacred heart of Jesus Christ will triumph. As a marounite, i see the way forward for SSPX to function in much the same way as we Marounite congregations function; interestingly, we are getting in the numbers from all cultures who crave orthodoxy in liturgy and Biblical teaching but find it thin on the ground in other places. The SSPX will be a source of vital flight-feathers in the wings of Christ's Church. May the Holy Spirit permiate every corrner of these discussions and the hearts and souls of those involved, for all our sakes,
Blessings,
Sarah,
Australia.
Judging by the article below, things are going well indeed!
http://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2012/04/for-record-latest-tornielli-fellays.html
Question:
The Church allows the TLM and there are many TLM churches around the world. I thought I had understood the SSPX position, but maybe I don't, so if the Church allows TLM's what is the big beef between the Vatican and SSPX? I thought that was the major split!
Mr Knight, I agree with you that the Church needs the SSPX, but it is eqully true that the SSPX needs the church. Being on the outside looking in has never been truly the catholic thing to do. Pete Frey
The sspx needs the church has never been an issue . The society has ALWAYS acknowledged that- hence always accepting the pope as their pope. The question should be- Why has Rome changed and not for the better? If and when the church actually changes direction , I imagine the society will disappear - no longer necessary.
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